FEATURED DOWNLOAD: Read and download the full transcription of Episode 37. Ryan Magdziarz, reveals in this interview how to prepare a worth-remembering business seminar. (Click Here to Download Transcription)
Ryan is the director of Winning International and has a massive passion for changing lives. After running multiple successful ventures before the age of 20 and running a large online marketing agency, he decided he wanted to directly help grow entrepreneurs and their businesses themselves as opposed to simply helping them with online strategy alone.
With a soul focus on results, Ryan’s world-wide seminars and courses are renowned for sparking drastic rises in revenue and earnings which has sparked massive attention in the business education space. Above all his vision is to empower 1 Million people to live with Passion, Growth & Contribution to collectively raise $1 Billion for the fight against poverty and animal cruelty by 2025.
Topics of Conversation:
[01:11] On Coaching Coaches
[03:17] The Development of the Course
[06:35] Sorting Your Niche
[10:18] On Getting People and Keeping Them
[14:12] On Getting the Course
[19:31] Being a Thought Leader
[24:37] Getting Results
[26:13] Sample Scenario
[29:10] Structuring Data
[32:20] Key Stones and Core Products
[44:09] In Conclusion
Reach Out To Ryan Magdziarz:
- Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ryanmagdziarz
- Website: http://ryanmagdziarz.com/
- Website: http://winninginternational.com/
[00:14] Stephen: Hey guys, Stephen Esketzis here from Marketing on the Move and it’s been a while before I’ve done a podcast with the guests so I have managed to tee one up and it’s been really good so I’ve got my good friend and absolutely killer coaches coach, Ryan Magdziarz here.
How are you going Ryan?
Ryan: Good man, thank for having me here today. I’m very pumped to talk about how to create high end coaching courses online and we can just link it in and have a good discussion about marketing in relation to that so very, very pumped.
Stephen: Awesome, it’s good to have someone here in Melbourne. So just you guys know, I’ve got Ryan like sitting right next to me so it’s nice and easy.
Makes it a lot easier than doing it over Skype so yeah, let’s get into it. So Ryan, is a coaches coach, he sells a high-end coaching program to coaches.
Do you want to give the audience a little bit of information about what you do and who your target audience is?
And what they get out of your program?
[01:11] Ryan: Yeah, man, totally, so we run or I run Winning International with a couple of awesome and amazing people Mark Bowness and Mario Paguio. And we’ve been going about some months now.
Oh sorry, twelve months, and we pretty much help coaches scout a seven figure quickly and help a ton more people. We’ve got a massive mission to leave a huge dent on this earth by raking in a billion dollars for charity in the next ten years.
So we’ve got a pretty massive task ahead of us and yeah, we’re just smashing through that at the moment so we’ve got two main high-end programs. One is an 8 week, 4k program and one is a 12 month 25k program.
One’s called six figure coach, one’s called seven figure coach so nice and clean and every single person that we’ve worked with we get to the same structure when it comes to creating a high end online coaching program that balances the right mix between you know getting charged for what your true value is but also making sure that you set up a program that has the right balance to provide amazing experience and amazing results for the people you work with. So, let’s kick in to the questions man, and a sort of bit about me.
Stephen: Yeah awesome and I love how you’ve got the same process and systems so that the people go through that same process every time and you’ve got a winning formula or winning, I guess a bit of a pun there because it’s called winning international. But yeah, I’ve got a winning formula and they just keep powering through and tweaking it along the way.
So, let’s get started on the other side of things. Other than sales straight we’ll get to sales a little bit but how did you build this course out and what processes did you take to build this course out because I know an 8 week program, there’s a lot of content in there from what I’ve seen as well because Ryan works in the office, same office block as I do so we talk a lot and finally had the opportunity to grab him on the podcast but yeah, he’s in here very late.
He’s always hustling away and building this course so I want to know what sort of process do you do and what sort of work is involved in building a caliber of an 8 week course to really get the results that your clients are getting.
[03:17] Ryan: Yeah totally, that question can go a long way so let’s just dig into it. I think, to start off, it’s really important to know that when you’re building out of a premium program that you don’t just go ahead and build something.
It’s really important that you make sure that you’ve got the structure set right so if you’re a coach or a consultant and you’re wanting to kind of leverage your knowledge and build something pretty amazing with that. It’s obviously important to channel your knowledge and wisdom in the right direction.
Meaning that you have to nail your niche. So before building anything we want to make sure that we have the compass point in the right direction before we start working because it is a big process and it is a long walk so to speak.
So we got to make sure, so just quickly with a niche, you want to make sure that you’ve got a niche that is profitable and that you’re super passionate about it because if you’re a coach and you’re wanting to channel your efforts in one direction, you got to make sure that you’re doing something that you love and also again, you’ve got your compass pointing in the right direction so you’re going to get that return that you deserve from the program. So, we got to have a niche, we’ve got to make sure that we’re working with people that have a really big problem so we can create an awesome big solution and really change their life.
We need to make sure that we can actually deliver so we need to have the problem in place; the problem needs to be painful enough. I usually say, it needs to be a hundred thousand problem and if you were to solve it perfectly it needs to be the biggest thing that’s holding your niche back right now than it was and then moving forwards you need to have a promise as well.
So, you need to have the start point of where they are with the problem right now. You need to have the end point with a promise.
So we’re actually promising that you’re going to get them at the end of your program and thirdly you need to have the proficiency so you need to know that you can deliver what you’re really offering. If every single person that went through your program was at the right stop point so they were in your niche, implementing what you thought, every single person should be able to get results from going through that process.
So that’s a little bit about niche and once you’ve got your niche there and you know that’s profitable and you’re super passionate about it and then you can start considering building out your costs. So, we talk about building two main courses.
One’s called a keystone product which is usually six, eight, or twelve weeks, and the framework’s built online and I’ll talk a little bit later in the conversation what you’d put in it to suffice the best possible experience. But, at six, eight, or twelve week program, somewhere between 1 and 5k usually, although we do have a client that’s got a 35k program for their keystone and then 125k for their core over in the US which is pretty cool so it’s about having a keystone and a core.
So let’s just focus on the keystone first because that’s where you’re going to start. We don’t want to over-confuse things and do many things at once we just want to absolutely nail the keystone product the first premium course.
Six, eight, or twelve weeks, 1 to 5k, and the best way to approach doing something that’s a big task because the way that we usually do it is every single week throughout the six, eight, or twelve weeks there’s usually between 5 or 7 lessons per week and the lessons are pretty in-depth so with our program for example. There are 48 lessons, some lessons have up to 10 videos so there’s over a 100 videos and it’s a very in-depth process to create that.
Stephen: It’s huge.
[06:35] Ryan: Yeah, massive and so obviously, the sole goal behind what you’re doing needs to be to create a world-class program. Once you’re clear on your niche and you know how you’re different and how you service that specific person you want to set your goal to be the best in the world for what you do.
Meaning you’re going to put a lot of effort into creating that program so instead of just going out and creating the content after you got your niche sorted, it’s really important that you sell first and then build the course second or else you’ll get stuck and a lot of coaches get in this place whether they’re building a workshop or a course or something they spend weeks and weeks and months and months second guessing the quality and thinking the quality of that cost is going to make or break whether on not people buying it. So they get stuck and their marketing struggles because they aren’t doing anything so they don’t get any sales.
The casual struggles so I would suggest doing the following process to kick-off and launch. You need to set a date, for when you’re going to launch.
So when is the first week of this launch program so it’s a group program or one to many program that you should be launching and it’s important that everyone goes through that process together as a team because it’s one of the main crucial elements of having a great cost which is the community element and so you want to set a date, and it may be four weeks away, it might be six weeks away or two weeks away, you want to set a date. You want to set a goal of how many people you want in it.
So, let’s just say you got a 5k course and you set a goal that in 4 weeks, I want to have 10 people in. So, you’ve got 4 weeks, your goal is to get 10 people in which is 50k in sales which is actually pretty awesome.
So, you’d set the date, you set the goal and then you should just be selling and you should be marketing. Yeah, marketing, selling, marketing, selling just to get those 10 people in.
As soon as you have 10 people in they already know the start date there’s no way that you can get out of creating the content so that puts you in a position where you’re forced to have to create something and this is the way we launch that very first core. So in the first two weeks; week 1 we run a seminar and get that first 5 sales.
Week 2 we run another one and we get another 5 sales and then Monday of week 3 we pretty much launched with our first course and we haven’t started creating content until a couple of days before. So we had 10 people going through it but everybody loved it because we know our stuff and we decided to create it so we created the first few days content, put people through it and then while they’re doing those first few days we created the next couple of days and they went through that and then we created the next couple of days so it’s just staying that step ahead throughout the first course.
But since then, twelve months down the track from starting to winning international and launching our first 8-week course. We’ve redone it a couple of times and you will sharpen things up but to get started just set the date, set the goal, and start selling.
Stephen: That’s epic. What an answer guys. So I guess that gives people a really good outline on how to get started with these courses, because it is daunting, you see a lot of guys, not even just, maybe not even high clause but like if you’ve gone to Udemy you see people spending ages putting their course together and then they wonder where their sales are coming from, they don’t know how to sell them, they wonder about all these technicalities instead of who is actually going through the course.
Because at the end of the day that’s what matters, getting the results from the people that go through the course. So you want to make sure that you can actually get people in the course to get those results. So that’s awesome, I love that.
So building on that, let our audience know how do you get people into your course?
So, obviously it would be different for each but there’s a few sales strategies which I’m sure you guys follow and it would be awesome to hear a little bit about how you get people in because a 4k course, let’s be honest, it’s not a cheap course. It’s not something you go on the Internet and you decide to buy.
It’s something which takes a bit of time to talk to the prospect and get them in. So maybe, let’s go through, what’s your process of getting people within the first course and then the process of ascending them to the second one as well.
[10:18] Ryan: Yeah, okay, cool so, how do we get people into our course, I think it’s kind of like almost a 2-part question, so, from a marketing point of view, how do we find people to jump in to our course. We have 2 main strategies, the first one is online marketing, which is very broad, ad bonanza, but we utilize online marketing mainly Facebook ads and we have multiple funnels which we use to drive traffic through and then get leads which we get on the phone with or on Skype or even face to face if they happen to be local but that’s quite rare.
Stephen: So, 90% you’d say on the phone using your sales funnels I guess?
Ryan: Yeah, at the moment we just started off at Australia for logistic reasons, with our course. We do have a few international clients however with our 12-month program, most people are in Australia.
So yeah, most of the time it’s just phone. You can still do foreign sales obviously if it’s international we just have to jump on Skype, it’s just easy to do local for us, basically it’s either phone or Skype.
It doesn’t really makes a massive difference in terms of conversion. The sales process is the most important thing, so, that’s the first strategy we use, online marketing and we can discuss. Steve’s obviously great at marketing so it’ll be great to have a chat at that next, and then secondly we use partnerships.
So finding a win-win with other organizations that have our audience and that allows us to get in big audiences and generate a lot of leads in order to sell that way as well. So, I reckon, anywhere from sort of 2 to 5 sales a week into our 4k product would come from partnerships and then pretty similar amount per week from online marketing as well.
So, it’s quite easy, it’s quite a pretty even split so that’s the marketing side of things. In terms of selling, we go through, and to be honest, I’m quite intuitive at this stage, which can sometimes be a good thing and sometimes be a bad thing.
But, I don’t really follow a script at this point, however all that clients that go through that 2-step process that we teach and that goes through a 4-step framework to sell and I feel like if we can quickly break this down that will be helpful for the guys.
Stephen: Yeah, awesome.
Ryan: And, it’s just important to note that there’s no one best process. I feel like when it comes to selling, especially in selling a high-end course if you know that you’re working with people that have the biggest problem right now in their life holding them back and that you’re course is the solution to that problem, really, really important mindset to note around this is that if you don’t get somebody and you’re kind of doing them a disservice so what if I guess, A-ha moments around the mindset but I feel like would make way more of a difference than the framework but I’m happy to break down the framework as well.
So just to be clear, I think it’s 90% your level of certainty like how committed, how certain you are that you can actually call somebody into the program. How much are you coming from a place of hover, are you coming from the hardy, do you literally want to authentically help these people or is it just are you going in there to make a sale?
Stephen: And, I think before you get into the framework, it’s a great way that you put it like, some of the great Canon, I’m sure you’re familiar with, one of the ways that he sees it is you’re delivering such a great service that it would be a shame, like you’re giving them a disservice by not giving them an opportunity to join your course. Because you know how much of an impact it will make in their lives, so when people think of hard sale I guess it really depends on the minds that you’re in where do you feel like you’re really just pitching a product or are you going to be pitching an opportunity to change their lives.
With you guys I definitely know that the course and results you’re getting, it’s a no-brainer, you go in there and you say, “This, you map it out and you go through your framework but at the end of the day you come from such a level of certainty that you know that your course is going to change their life and get them the revenue they need.
[14:12] Ryan: Yeah, exactly, that is an awesome point to make. We put everything into our course, and when you’re have premium online courses that leverage but is also set around in world class and delivering 50% experience for you to send results and just helping them get to the place they need to be, you know you put your heart and soul into it.
And you have such a level of focus that the money that comes from that like finances aren’t an issue. It’s about changing lives.
So, it’s really easy to quantify in your head, the value that you’re giving to people and so it’s not a hard sell at all. Usually the way that I speak about selling from a mindset point of view, if you look at the average standard when it comes to closing, especially if it’s coaches, it’s around 10 to 20% so, 1 or 2 out of 10 people.
If you’re on the frontal to qualify a lead, 1 or 2 will get closed so from my point of view, that’s kind of ridiculous, we convert at 90% plus in our business and one of our coaches go through a similar process and they go to 10 to 20% and from 80 to 80% plus after they adopted this mindset, this paradigm shift which is to think about it from the point of view, of as exactly as you said, sell and be sold. You’re either going to convert somebody and change their life or they’re going to convince you of why it’s not right for them to change right now.
Pretty much, the way I look at it, that your goal is to help them go from a place where they’re in a difficult spot and get to this amazing place and when you’re going through the conversation and when they jump in and they’re asking questions about where they’re at right now and the problems that they’ve had and you sort of feel that pain point of where they’re at. They’re at a pretty low place in terms of energy.
They’re just low energy and probably leally low certainty and they’re not coming from the best version of them. But as soon as you start to talk about their goals and what’s possible for them and you’re being a true coach by inspiring them to raise up what happens is that their level goes from low to being high and when you’re at a sales call obviously you’re the best version of yourself.
Your sole goal for being on that phone call is to change someone’s life. It’s to give them that opportunity to transform.
So, they’ve gone from a low place and you’ve inspired them to go up to a high place and be a better version of themselves in that couth throughout that process. But then all of a sudden when it comes from to the sales calls at the end of it.
You’re close, right before pulling the trigger all of a sudden disbelief start to kick in and instead of you being right on top as well. Being the best version of yourself, when you ask for the sale and they start throwing out objections.
Usually the coach will drop down and their level goes from being really empowered and being the best version of themselves and they actually drop down. Like you work so hard to raise someone up and show them what was possible at the start, get them to a higher sort of vibration or whatever you want to call it and then you drop back down to pulling the trigger.
Stephen: I think something like that, it must be Tony Robbins with the saying, two things actually, number one is, when you bring your vibration down to that level then the person you’re trying to close also drops down. So, regardless, it’s very contagious, yeah, so I think you definitely set the standard of the call and you’re the person leading the call so you really need to obviously lead the person’s direction.
Stephen: So, that’s number one and the other thing that Tony Robbins mentioned was, when I went to one of his events at Melbourne here, he pretty much said, sell me a pen or something like that, Jordan Belfort style and then everyone stood up and looked to the person next to each other and saw the pen and now sell the pen. If you didn’t sell this pen, your family will die or your family will get hostaged and get kidnapped. And you see everyone’s jumped up and they started and they got all this power and energy and they’re at level 10 and you just wonder to train yourself to get to that level, imagine the opportunity you’re missing out on because you just dropped at the end of that call.
Imagine all that blank space in between that level 10, that level 2 or 3 that just brings you down. That’s how I guess what makes a successful coach and successful businessperson to someone who’s not. Because you’re not giving them that opportunity because you’re limiting yourself from what you can do.
Ryan: Yeah, it comes back to certainty and Tony Robbins is a beast advocator of state management getting in that state where you’re just totally certain and that’s just a powerful question to say.
What would you do if you were going to die or if you had to make this happen and I had a gun to your head and would you find a way to make it happen?
And so yeah, you totally would and what happens is when they ask for a sale and somebody starts to throw out objections, boom they drop right down, the coach drops. Okay, because when the coach drops, obviously, the alpha person drops as well so you’ve got two main options.
And this is where most coaches’ slip up it’s like you’ve pretty much pitched in and said; cool do you want to come into my course? You wouldn’t use those words, but do you want to join me and so on. And their energy goes back down and your rollers are purged.
It’s to cement yourself as that thought leader to inspire them to rise back up because they’re scared. Before they take an action that’s big financially they’re scared but more importantly they’re scared to take that leap of faith. Because they know shit’s going to change.
[19:31] Ryan: And so you need to be there, as their thought leader to lift them back up instead of also sort of listening to their beliefs because the overwhelming obvious to frame it is that it’s the worst version of your client versus the best version of you and if you don’t make the sale the worst version of themselves when they’re limiting their beliefs and everything is convincing the best version of you why they shouldn’t do it.
Stephen: Yeah, that’s so powerful. I love that; it’s a really good way to put it.
Ryan: Go for it.
Stephen: I was just going to say, that yeah, when you explain it like that, the person on the other end of the call they’re struggling. They’re the ones looking for advice and if you let them sell on the idea that they don’t need help then I think there’s a massive disconnect and you’re not doing your job as a coach.
Ryan: That’s true, very true. It’s harsh but it’s true.
Stephen: That’s it, I think that it’s a harsh truth but yeah, that’s crazy. So before we wrap up the sales, give us a little bit about the framework. So, you go through jump on the phone, because I know there’s a lot of different ways to sell. You can just ask questions left and right and stand there and hope to build relationships and build rapport and sell or you can do it strategically and have a few ideas in mind.
So what’s your approach to the framework you use when you get on the phone with a prospect?
Ryan: Yeah, sweet, I’ll jump to the framework in a sec but just to quickly wrap up if you’re happy for me to.
Stephen: Yeah, go for it.
[20:50] Ryan: So it’s like before, one or two out of ten people you actually convince and be the best person of yourself and help them lift back up. But most of the time eight out of nine people that coaches speak to have the worst version of prospect convinced you as the best version of you as the coach why they shouldn’t do it.
So, if he’s going to flip it around and put it the way that it should be, it should at least be a minimum fifty percent more than half the time the best version of you should be able to inspire the worst version of them and lift them back up and get ready to take action and change their life. So, that’s the way that we look at it and I think that mindset makes a massive difference.
I would honestly attribute all sales conversions towards that thing.
Ryan: Moving forward, in terms of the framework, myself admire our work together to come up with the framework we call CAPE.
Stephen: Sounds like a superhero.
Ryan: It is, so it’s a forceful process. So, CAPE, C-A-P-E; C stands for capture attention step 1 so starting the conversation as a leader and leading the conversation right from the start. You’ve got 4 seconds at the beginning of the conversation, to create an impact and to really show people that you’re a leader and you’re here to help.
Okay, because, people doesn’t want to take advice from somebody that is not in that state of certainty. They want to actually work with somebody who is there where they want to be.
And so you need to show that leadership quality right from the start. Step number 2 is to ask questions. So, A, ask questions and so usually you frame it as a sort of discovery call. I just want to ask a bunch of questions and figure out exactly where you are right now and exactly where you want to be and we want to figure out all of the problems that are holding you back and then work on them so I can present something that can really help you overcome from that start point to that end point and give you as much clarity as I can.
So you just want to get into it and ask a lot of questions. You want to ask questions in 2 different ways, okay, you want to go wide, meaning, and you want to deep. You want to ask lots of different types of questions to try to identify the key pain points that they’ve got and the key problems that’s stopping them and when you find something that is a big problem, whereas it’s a hot topic you can ask questions that probe deeper into the problems that they’re going through.
Ryan: So, let’s say for example, you’re a fitness coach, and you’re struggling with nutrition, you know I can say, okay, cool tell me a bit more about what that’s done for you in the past. So tell me a little bit of history with that.
They might go in and say, what diets have they tried, something like that and then you’ll know what’s the result being from not having consistency with your diet and not knowing what to eat, what have you done as a result of that and how has that affected you. And so you just keep asking questions and sort of going more and more motive, going as wide as logical, going deep for motive and so you’re asking more why questions and how has that affected you.
It’s getting more to the immersions so it’s really important to go wide and go deep to find the areas they need help with and then also get deep into the pain points so actually realize that they’ve come here with a problem and it’s not just a surface level conversation because if someone needs to get to that point where they need to change, they need to realize, they’ve got a problem.
Ryan: So, that’s the essence of section number 2. Just asking questions. Scene 3, basic but it’s really important or ask you if you’re just aiming in the completely wrong direction and you start to help and provide advice because they’re not going to value advice if you haven’t aimed it at their core problems.
Stephen: So that’s like a problem identification framework. That’s how you really get to the depth of what’s their problem, looking around, and then you really isolate what their main issue is.
FEATURED DOWNLOAD: Read and download the full transcription of Episode 37. Ryan Magdziarz, reveals in this interview how to prepare a worth-remembering business seminar. (Click Here to Download Transcription)
[24:37] Ryan: Yeah, and then there’s usually a few different things that they’re not doing right and that are stopping them from getting results like if we talked to a coach usually they think that the problem is they don’t know how to generate leads or they don’t know how to sell but a lot of the time it’s more core level than that. They don’t have a good niche, they don’t have a right price range, their model is wrong and to be honest with you it’s usually personal development focus.
Because coaches aren’t making seven figures in their business it’s usually down to lack of action and that comes down to more mindset and the intangible things that make a big difference as opposed to the strategies and the ideas, but it’s about, identifying those few problems. So you summarize and you say, okay cool, and now we’re essentially going to the stages of step 2.
Now we’re going to ask a bunch of questions and I’ll pretty much figure out where you’re at so just let me confirm with you that you don’t know what to eat, you’re struggling with knowing what to do at the gym, exercise, and etc, and a random example, summarize, what the core problems are at you found where and then say was there anything else that you kind of need help with or struggling with.
Stephen: So you don’t, let’s do a quick role play I think that would be valuable to the people who are listening. So let’s say I am a relationship coach, let’s go with that.
I jump on the phone, what’s your opening line?
How do we get into this?
Like, I won’t stretch it out for too long, but give me an example of how we get into this. So I jump on and say,
“Hey Ryan, how are you going?
Awesome to chat?”
How do you open up?
[26:13] Ryan: It’s just something really simple, like, what’s your name?
Stephen: My name’s Stephen.
Ryan: Oh, you don’t say that on the call.
Stephen: I’m sorry.
Ryan: “Hi Stephen, Ryan here from Winning International, pumped for chat today so let’s get straight into it.”
Ryan: It doesn’t have to be something super complicated.
Stephen: No, so just keep it simple.
Ryan: Something full of energy and positive.
Stephen: Awesome, yeah, and then you start out saying, “So how can I help you today? Or do you usually?”
Ryan: You’ve got a call scheduled already so you jump straight into it and just outlay the purpose of the chat so you’ll be like, “My goal for our chat today is to help you as much as I possibly can. So to do that I’m just going to ask a bunch of questions kind of going to be like a discovery call so that we can figure out exactly what’s stopping you from getting the best results, we’re going to really cram where you are right now, where you want to go to and then identify the key areas that’s stopping you from getting those results that you want.
Stephen: That’s awesome, I love that.
Ryan: Just a lot of questions.
Stephen: And I think that’s a really friendly way of opening up, like you’re sort of building up rapport as you go. So like you said, you go wide, keep it service level and go deeper and deeper obviously they’re going to open up and you’ll start to see the problems.
Ryan: Yeah, so that’ll be like the entry and you’ll see something like knowing exactly the way as I said. But just get into the questions and start asking questions.
It’s also really important to note that you can’t stuff up a sales call. It’s not about wording everything perfectly.
You can literally talk shit for like 5 minutes and just bring the conversation back and you haven’t lost the sale. You know, it’s completely fine, it’s just that literally coming from the heart, pushing forward and making sure that you do hit those main four areas that we’re going through.
So we’ve gone through 1 and 2, so we’ve gone through capture attention and ask questions, summarize asking questions by asking if there’s anything else and then move forwards. Step number 3, so it’s prescribed solutions.
So you’ve asked, questions, you’ve figured out what the problems are, step number three is prescribed solutions. Now that you’ve actually figured out what’s stopping him, the purpose of step three is to literally show your credibility and show them that you’re great at what you do by identifying the problems that they’ve had and giving them key solutions as to why those problems are happening and how they can solve them.
So it’s very why they’re not succeeding and what they need to do to fix it. You don’t have to go too in-depth to the how, like really in-depth to doing this step-by-step but just surface level but showing them that you have the solutions so, again, to plain frame.
It’s when I do a call it could easily bounce within step two and three there’s no exact script I think and say the same thing every time I enter the conversation, it’s very intuitive however just using a framework to start with can be very helpful. So, step three, let’s just say for example, you’ve identified 3 core problems.
So when you get to step 3 in your prescribing solutions, the easiest way to do it is to hit each of those problems one by one.
Stephen: So let’s say that I’m a dating coach and I don’t have a membership site so one of those maybe, you’d say, look, one of the things I’ve found is you need to have a membership site at xpricepoint to be a leader in your industry, is that something you’d say?
How would you prescribe that issue if I’m going through one to one rather than one to many?
[29:10] Ryan: Yeah, so let’s just say, for example the problem is that they don’t know how to structure their product?
Stephen: Yeah, much better.
Ryan: Yeah? Something like that? Okay, cool. So, let’s just say that was the problem and now the problem was that they didn’t know how to generate leads because they’re just trying to cold call or something ridiculous?
Stephen: Love it.
Ryan: And when they did get someone on the phone they weren’t converting anyone.
Ryan: So when you go through and you’ve asked questions and you found out their problem so that when you go to prescribed solutions, you’d hit each of them one by one.
Stephen: Got it.
Ryan: Okay, so you start of and you go, okay cool, to start with, one of the biggest problems that you’re facing right now is that you don’t have a structure of your knowledge. Okay, at the moment you’ve been dancing around between, going in and you introduce the problem and then you need to explain it again so they kind of get it and they understand it again and it’s just brought back to life and then you need to go into why is that a problem.
So here’s what the problem is, here’s why it’s a problem, so look, you don’t know how to structure your products. You’ve been trying to do this, this, and this.
And the reason why that’s a problem is because, you’re chopping and changing around heaps of small low-end stuff. But small low-end stuff is great to try to pocket money here and there but because you don’t focus on one thing that delivers a solution, you know, people don’t come back as raving fans.
You don’t get huge results and when you put in all that effort into getting a sale, you don’t get properly rewarded because you’ve got low-end stuff. And so you never really gain attraction, never gain momentum and life is hard in the business. Okay.
Stephen: That’s a really good way to put it, I mean; you hit the problem straight on the head. I like that.
Ryan: Yeah, so this is just a random example right? Role play, so you just explain what the problem is, why it’s a problem and you just explain, okay cool, here’s what you need to do and then you go into the solution and then talk about how that’s going to make a difference.
Stephen: I love that.
Ryan: That’s what you do for each of the three problems; here’s the problem that we spoke about. Here’s why it’s a problem, okay. Here’s what you need to do and here’s how it’s going to make a difference.
Ryan: And I know that you might want to listen to that again to comprehend it.
Stephen: Okay, guys, feel free to rewind and take notes. It’ll be on the show notes as well, so you guys can also check out the transcription too.
Ryan: Yeah cool, awesome, so really important at the end of it, that’s just one problem, you’ve just gone through. You might spend five minutes just explaining that one problem, and then when you get to the end of the problem really key easy way to embed trust because this is just the core skeleton of what you need to do on a sales call but throughout the process you should be assuming a sale and you should be building trust dropping knowledge bombs, here, there and everywhere.
In sports I never knew that in sports but there’s heaps of different little things that you should be doing along the way but to really key big way that you can embed proof into the process is when you go through and say, okay cool, I found three problems and am now going to prescribe you solutions. Step number three, so I just went through and spoke about one problem and I gave a solution for that.
So now at the end of that solution I’m going to give an example, I’m going to give a case study, which is really easy. So at the end of every each of the three solutions that you give you should have a case study of how you’ve helped somebody that was struggling with the same problem, get to the same solution and what the results were like for them.
Stephen: Go on.
[32:20] Ryan: So, let’s say for example, you’re a dating coach and then I went through and said, what you should be doing is to create a key stone and a core product as opposed to having all these scattered little things around your workshop and a seminar that you need a plan a retreat and go on a membership site etc. What we need to be doing is a case and a call and I’ll give you an example.
You worked with one of the clients and this is an actual case study called Camille, and she came to us she was making $500 a week, struggling to get by which was an amazing coach with a big following and we just stripped all that stuff away, concentrated on building one key stone product which was innately called how to construct content and then the next week she shared the biggest financial week she had in her entire life.
Stephen: That’s awesome.
Ryan: She haven’t even built it yet, nothing changed except for the confidence around it but then over the next few months, she went from making $500 a week to $5000 a week having clients that were so much more happier because she was actually being responsible for the results. The only reason I tell you that is to show you that you really can get the results if you adopt these strategies.
So you’re not just flaunting a testimonial or a case for no reason, it’s in context. It builds into the conversation, it builds auto proof and then you move on to, okay, cool, so now that’s what you need to do for that, let’s move on to the fact that you’re not generating leads, same process, to the end.
Stephen: I like that format there, I think everyone listening on here is going to have a whole lot of mind-blowing knowledge bomb shifts so keep them coming, this is awesome. Guys, take note that it doesn’t have to be a complicated thing. It doesn’t have to be something where you’re shaking on the phone when you’re about to call a prospect like it’s a casual chat and that’s what I like about it.
None of these is intrusive hard selling, it’s all literally just what’s your issue, let’s have a chat, alright now here’s how we can make a solution and giving them the best solution so it’s all coming from the heart.
Ryan: Yeah, it’s giving lots of value as well because you’re actually telling them what they need to be doing.
Ryan: You’re providing trust, it’s really important though to just reframe the way that you look at the sales call whenever any client starts to get nervous about selling which happens all the time even if they’re super star coaches. Like one of our amazing clients Andrieu Sells, got a brand called Loving yourself to Health and he gets a little bit nervous before a call and so do I but she’s closing in like 80 to 90% when she was closing in much lower before she didn’t even have a programmable start which is crazy.
It’s just a 1k product, but the reframe is that it’s not about selling; it’s not about making a sale. It’s about going there and giving as much value as you can and being the best that you can and coming from the heart and just having a conversation.
Ryan: Because once you get on the call and you’ve got into the groove of it, it becomes all easier. If it’s not scary it’s not nerve-wracking.
Stephen: And the thing is, you’re in the zone and you’re not forced to make a sale to cover this week’s rent. That’s the thing I think. A lot of people come from the shift way of “Man, I got to make this sale because this week’s rent is coming up and the phone bill and the lights on and the water and I wont be able to go to the toilet and whatever.
It’s like, they make the sale for the wrong reasons and I think as soon as you’ve got this cause together, people are so confident and clear like you said, a hundred percent clarity on what they’re doing and the outcome they’ll deliver it’s not a sale anymore. It’s just a deliver of value.
Ryan: Yeah, totally because if someone knows that they’ve got what they consider to be the best cause in the world for their niche. They’re going to be confident backing it and they can reframe the way that they call and an opportunity to change someone’s life even if they don’t go ahead and it’s just an easy process so that’s step three anyways.
You give the solution, case study at the end and then you need to bridge the gap into the close. So you got, CAPE. See, Capture attention, Ask questions, Prescribe solutions and then Empower action and the key word being empower.
Really important that you actually see there’s a positive process as we mentioned before with the mindset stuff and showing them that they actually do have what it takes to get the results as opposed to trying to force somebody to do something and there’s a few key structural things that you can put in place to make this process easier. One really great question that I learned from one of my mentors, it’s just a single question, which is,
where do you think we should go from here?
Yeah, you kind of summarize where you’re at, so you have a kind of long conversation. You can be on the phone for a minimum thirty minutes sometimes longer. Find to build trust and spend a little bit longer on the frame if you know you’re going to make a couple of grand or five grand or even a grand because you’re getting rewarded for your time and you’re not just selling a hundred dollar product.
So, you can afford to spend that time. You summarize and talk about what you’ve gone through so far, you should have seeded the cost a few times already and been really assumptive with the fact that that’s your goal for them. So they know that’s their, you’ve really mentioned the cost four or five time before it gets to that point it’s no secret that that’s the goal.
So it’s not just like, oh by the way, spring. Here you go, 100k cost coming right up.
Stephen: Yeah, have them throw and it just comes right out of nowhere. Drops on their lap, massive bomb. 25k order bomb, so you say it, you pre-frame it.
Ryan: Yeah, so when you get to the end of the quoting value and then you’ve gone through and solved the problems, you know, the question is, where do you think we should go from here. And when you ask that question your goal of what you’re trying to do is for them to turn around and ask you about the cost.
Not for you to ask them and try to just come out of nowhere talking about your cost. They ask you and you’re in the position of power in that situation and you can really explain it and you’ll just be like, alright, I’ll tell you, just trying to throw benefits and features and stuff so frame nicely and smooth transition and most of the time people will say, “Oh, can you tell me a little bit about the cost that you’re mentioning.”
And so, not only do you pre-frame the cost and that being your goal for them because that is how you help people change their life, you also mention the price so when it finally gets to that end point again, it’s not mentioning the prices like, yeah. Because they already know the price, so where do you think we should go from here?
Oh can you tell me a little bit about your cost?
You say, yeah, no worries at all, I’m glad you asked. And then you can go into the next process which is part of empowering action and the way that we get our clients to talk about the cost the way we talk about the cost is that we start highest chunk, and sort of like, more emotional and then we start talking about the cost in a more of a micro level and more logical and specific and I’ll show you what that means. So, step 1 number 1, talk about the promise. That’s the highest chunk. So talk about the outcome, from my point of view, all I personally care about is results when I’m speaking with people sometimes people get caught up with asking lots of questions about macro stuff and I just crack and say, that this stuff is just not relevant there is no point talking about this stuff.
The reality is our goal for you is to become a six figure coach. That’s what we’ll do everything in our power to get you there. That’s the goal; everything else is just an ingredient to get there. It’s not important, the logistics doesn’t matter the reality is we’re going to keep working with you until you get the results and that’s the promise.
So you start off at the promise anyways, and that’s the overriding goal of this course is to help you find the man of your dreams. Okay, period. That’s the promise, as a result of doing this course, you will find the man of your dreams and I’ll continue helping you until you do. Yup, so big promise, massive over-reaching.
And so without a promise, people can be interested but they lack urgency so having that promise in place can be really powerful. You then, sort of take the next step down, okay; you talk about how you can go into model so you go into the breaking down the different strategies that you can use.
When we work with clients, when we work with coaches we help them create what we call the business DNA which is essentially a set of pillars and so I’ll go through what those pillars are so for us, in Winning International. Our assets of pillars are Design, so designing a blueprint.
Attract, attracting leads, Convert, converting clients. Perform, performing world class and Setting up a world class performance, lead, leverage and succeed. So lead is all about being a thought leader and doing thought leadership strategies, like all casts and doing big events and authoring books and getting into media and stuff like that.
Now leverage is obviously systems and NBAs and succeeds as personal developments stuff so there are seven pillars but in six figure coach we go and talk about 4 of those pillars so we break those pillars down and we go through them one by one. So pillar number one, design. Designing a blueprint, that’s the first thing that we do to help you become a six figure coach so we help you come go from a place of being stuck and unclear to having clarity and becoming unstoppable.
Okay, that’s the goal, the way we do that is one moment we go over a few of the micro stuffs so we help you get super pro on your niche, help you design your business model, help you grow your price plan, understand how to break down your 12 month goal and bring it back down to what you have to do daily to achieve that goal and etc and then we go through the four pillars. So that’s model, promise, here’s what the goal of the program is.
Model, here are the different strategies that we’re going to take you through to get that result, step number three is the logistics and that’s just how you deliver that content and what else is in the course to make sure, so these are the features. These are for the guys that ordered 3 digital that need the details this is where you go through that stuff and you get really in depth and even they’re not all really 3 digital this is just the icing on the cake. Just making sure that you…
Stephen: Cover all the bases.
Ryan: Yeah, cover all the bases, exactly. Talk about how you run it, you get these many sessions with this and we run it by webinars and we talk about all the benefits that each of the logistics have and we go through that and then lastly you get to the end and that’s where you talk about pricing. But I feel like the most important thing in terms of asking for the sale and this would be the biggest best piece of advice in terms of having a structured mind selling it’s the reframe. So instead of saying, do you want to buy my program, reframe it and putting it back on them, and asking them whether or not they’ve got what it takes to get results by implementing your content so instead of saying, hey, do you want to buy my course?
You’d say, look, we both know that our course is going to get results, we’re 100% clear on that. We know this is right for you and we’d love to have you in there.
But I want to make sure that if you go in there that you’ve got, jump through hoop number 1, jump through hoop number 2, jump through hoop number 3. I want to make sure that you’re someone that takes action, I want to make sure that you’re willing to go that next level essentially that’s what I say.
I want to make sure that you’re willing to step up because the biggest problem that we personally have with the coaches that go through the course and we’ve been a lot of hours and hours and weeks and months into putting systems into help with these is that people won’t take action on the strategies that you teach. So I make sure that instead of saying do you want to join the course I want to make sure that they’re right for the course because if they can’t answer the question then I know that there’s a chance that they’re not going to be right for our sale so instead of saying do you want to buy the course I say, look we know the course are going to get results it’s obvious we know that you’re going to be great for this, my question to you and something that I can’t help you with is whether or not you’re willing to step up and go that next level.
Ryan: Because if you were at that level that you need to be to get results you’d already have results so just implementing what I teach is not enough. Now I need to know that you’re going to be willing to go top that next level because if you’re not you’re going to stay exactly where you are to spot the content to spot the strategies. Because some people we work with, go through the strategies and make 4k in 4 weeks. Other people go through the strategies and do nothing.
[44:09] Ryan: So, are you the person that’s going to take action are you willing to step up or not.
Stephen: I love how that sort of reframes like you said, it’s such a powerful way of really weighing in the dos to the goners.
Are you going to do this or just do it?
That’s it and I think the proof is in the pudding and I mean after that you’re probably an hour into the call, over an hour and a half sometimes I don’t know but after that the people there who are on the call aren’t getting the results so you know for a fact that they’re currently where they are and they haven’t gotten the results like they can’t pussyfoot around the actual answers. They’ll literally just say look I’m ready to take action and change what I’m doing because I’m in a rut or yeah, look I’ll think about it, I’m not really sure I don’t think it’s right for me.
Like, I think, the only thing is that it’s really up to them if they go through and then it really weighs out the shitty clients who are really just going to sit back and go on a beach and just have the membership site there to the people who want to take action and really change their lives.
Ryan: And the really cool thing about getting a premium course is that when they do invest and they do take that leap of faith, that they’re totally committed, they’re putting in a decent amount of cash so they’re all in. Not like if you were to go to a free seminar and you’ll feel good at the end but you’ll never do anything versus if you go invest like a 100 k in a program you’re going to listen to everything that mentor has to say.
You’re going to get results so obviously not being that extreme but just having a 1 to 5 k program talking about the fact that you want to have people in there, that is going to be committed. They’re going to be powerful and 100% suggest doing that and the cool thing about that is when you say, are you willing to step up or are you going to be someone that takes action or you put it back on them then you maintain the position of power they can’t say no.
They can but most people aren’t going to want to they believe they’re going to take action. They’re not going to say no so you can object handle from a position of strength because they’re not saying no at joining their cause, they’re putting an objection as opposed to yes I’m going to stand up.
If they say yes that’s a soft course and if they say cool we’ll get you started we can go into getting the details and stuff. If they say no, they’re not saying no to the course.
Stephen: That’s just an objection that you’ve got to find.
Ryan: Yeah, they might come out and be like “Look like I kind of feel like I can but just not sure if I’m going to have time.” It’s a time objection. “I’m not sure if it’s right for me” then they haven’t seen the value of it.
So it’s an objection handle of position of strength and that’s when you need to step up as a thought leader. And you need to have that certainty, you need to inspire them as possible because that’s when the biggest fear kicks in and you will have to step up.
Stephen: That’s the whole point.
Ryan: We do things differently there are a lot of embedded things within that and that’s the skeleton so if you follow that process and those are the four main structures and you’ll do very well.
Stephen: Ryan has blown it out of the park today that should be worth over a million dollars of information just there. One final question before we let you go, how do you ascend people say that you’ve gotten people and that they’ve done it, they killed it, they’re getting results they’ve gone from 500 dollars a week to 5000 dollars a week, they’ve done the 8 week they made 3-4 week.
Give us two scenarios; One where someone may have gone through and achieved the results that they wanted or they’ve gotten, or two the person did really well and now you’re ready to ascend them,
how do you handle both those situations?
Ryan: That’s a great question and it’s a pretty easy one to answer, if people get results the next step is a no brainer that’s the goal in a case end product. You want to be the best in the world, so if people get amazing results the next step, is like every single person I think for the first 20 people that we asked we got a yes every time it wasn’t even a sound, it was a yeah of course.
Because one really important element is see the next level when I speak to people on a sales call, it’s not really a good thing to put in the fact that your goal is to get them to that point just make it obvious jest be like, I want to be working with you for years. I’m not interested in just putting you through an 8 week program so the goal of the 8 week program, is get you to a point where you’re ready for the core product, the long term product. So its really important to see that and if they great results they’re going to the next step and if they’re not ready and they didn’t get the results, you probably don’t want to be there anyways because they’re going to be a pain in the butt with payments and they’re not going to make stuff happen so what we do, occasionally, if somebody goes through and doesn’t get the results, we just put them back through the keystone. It’s leveraged and we’re here to help people, rather than go back through the programs, as opposed to going out and trying to make it happen themselves anyways. So, yup, there are your two main options.
Stephen: I love that, I think, it’s sort of smooth, like you said, because you’ve done such a great job in the initial product, it’s sort of like an after thought, there’s no real strategy behind it. Like you’ve said, the whole way through it, right, awesome, you got the results, now here you might need some more time to go back through the initial 8 week program, here are the areas that you need to work on. We’ll put you through here and then, we’re going to get you to that level and then there’d be a tiny percentage you obviously don’t implement and are a bit toxic to the course because you don’t want that spreading to other people in the course, so you’re better of getting rid of them and focusing on the people who are willing to make it happen, so that’s awesome man, it’s been awesome having you on and I appreciate you jumping in and taking almost, now an hour already in your day, so hopefully the audience would absolutely love it.
I’m sure what they’re heard today have been absolutely epic, if people want to learn more about you and your company, where can they go and find out more information?
Ryan: Yeah, great question, you can either try to just add me on Facebook and ask a question, and if I’ve got time, via Macroplier or something like that or you can go straight to Winning International and check with out content opt into some of that stuff and I’m sure we’ll gave a real soon.
Stephen: Yeah, awesome, I love that man, let you go now, have a great day then and everyone there listening on Marketing on the Move make sure you jump on the website we’ve got a lot of podcast coming up, we’ve booked a few more so there a lot on the way. So yeah, add Ryan on Facebook, great having you on, and I’m sure I’ll be seeing you soon.
Ryan: Thanks Dave, good luck to every body else and let us know if you’ve got any questions. Take care!